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#1 2013-05-02 10:18:56

gaucho
Contributor
From: France
Registered: 2010-06-15
Posts: 428
Website

group buy for proxmark3

We can buy Proxmark3 saving money for an order of 10 or more units.
Are you intererested? contact me. You can have Proxmark, included shipping to you, at 90€.
I will buy 2 and roel will buy another 2. We need only 6 persons to reach 10 units.
I will order it in china, I will upload the last firmware revision, or whatever you want on it, I will retest it, and ship to you from Italy.

Here the beginning of the discussion: http://www.proxmark.org/forum/viewtopic.php?id=1599

Last edited by gaucho (2013-05-03 10:39:01)


Imagination is more important than knowledge.

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#2 2013-06-10 18:21:23

gaucho
Contributor
From: France
Registered: 2010-06-15
Posts: 428
Website

Re: group buy for proxmark3

we reached 10 units. If someone wants to add to the group buy, let me know by mail (find it on my profile).


Imagination is more important than knowledge.

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#3 2014-01-25 19:02:35

krkuz
Member
Registered: 2014-01-25
Posts: 1

Re: group buy for proxmark3

Since all the units in the first run are sold is anybody interested in organizing another group?
I think gaucho will arrange everything for us.
I'm going to  buy 1 unit

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#4 2014-01-26 12:00:46

gaucho
Contributor
From: France
Registered: 2010-06-15
Posts: 428
Website

Re: group buy for proxmark3

let's see if you can reach 10 units, then we will find an arrangement.


Imagination is more important than knowledge.

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#5 2014-01-28 22:22:26

rcsagres
Member
Registered: 2011-12-05
Posts: 1

Re: group buy for proxmark3

I'm also interested in participating. I'll buy 1 unit as well.

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#6 2014-01-29 13:16:01

agent_x
Member
Registered: 2014-01-28
Posts: 1

Re: group buy for proxmark3

I'm also interested in 1 item.

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#7 2014-02-03 16:12:54

el_zoido
Member
Registered: 2014-02-03
Posts: 2

Re: group buy for proxmark3

I'll have one as well!

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#8 2014-03-01 17:39:22

L0RE
Member
Registered: 2014-03-01
Posts: 4

Re: group buy for proxmark3

I would also take one.
If its Possible to Order Antennas, I Would be also interested in

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#9 2014-03-02 10:47:52

gaucho
Contributor
From: France
Registered: 2010-06-15
Posts: 428
Website

Re: group buy for proxmark3

we can buy hirose connectors, or we can buy pcb antenna if you know how to do it, or we can do/buy home made antenna.


Imagination is more important than knowledge.

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#10 2014-03-03 00:22:37

Richard1799
Member
Registered: 2013-11-07
Posts: 3

Re: group buy for proxmark3

I am interested in one.

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#11 2014-03-03 12:27:49

L0RE
Member
Registered: 2014-03-01
Posts: 4

Re: group buy for proxmark3

gaucho wrote:

we can buy hirose connectors, or we can buy pcb antenna if you know how to do it, or we can do/buy home made antenna.

What would be the cheapest Way, since i'm new to Proxmark, I Would Trust your Experience, whats the best way to start

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#12 2014-03-03 21:12:52

el_zoido
Member
Registered: 2014-02-03
Posts: 2

Re: group buy for proxmark3

How many more buys do we need to reach 10 units?

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#13 2014-03-03 22:09:34

L0RE
Member
Registered: 2014-03-01
Posts: 4

Re: group buy for proxmark3

We are now 6 in the Thread . if nobody has "ordered" direktly by Gaucho
I Hope Every one Stays until we are Ten :-)

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#14 2014-03-04 18:25:21

hurgler
Member
Registered: 2014-03-04
Posts: 1

Re: group buy for proxmark3

Is the price (90$) still valid? As the post is a little older it could be no longer valid...

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#15 2014-03-04 21:15:22

gaucho
Contributor
From: France
Registered: 2010-06-15
Posts: 428
Website

Re: group buy for proxmark3

the group buy management takes a lot of resources on my side. I'm experiencing this.
90€ is really too low price to manage the process since in this price there is no gain for me.
Moreoever with the gained knowledge i'm able to guarantee the result by repairing the boards on my site, in case of errors made by the manufacturer.
I can propose 140€ for the board with home made HF antenna and shipment included.
nothing less.


Imagination is more important than knowledge.

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#16 2014-03-05 08:22:51

L0RE
Member
Registered: 2014-03-01
Posts: 4

Re: group buy for proxmark3

Thanks, but 140 would be to Expensive at the moment, so i have to step back.
I have to wait a little bit longer, but it doesn't matter since 140€ is nearly the same Price as GeZhi Electronic.
So i can Order when have a little more Cache.
But Thanks Gaucho
For your Great work

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#17 2014-03-26 19:26:16

gaucho
Contributor
From: France
Registered: 2010-06-15
Posts: 428
Website

Re: group buy for proxmark3

i can propose to try a restyling of the board for 80€, even less, maybe 70€, by removing some components, and doing the board on 2 layers. also removing the multiplexer (manual selection of the antenna hf or lf)
time needed to receive the board: about 6 months to be safe.
first payment 5€ in order to test the prototype
the remaining part if the prototype works fine.
minimum quantity to test the prototype: 10 (or 5 person if you pay double)
minimum quantity to build the units: 10.
i can share more details about my idea of restyling.

EDIT: where there is a risk you can save money, otherwise there is no reason to work for free. do you agree with me?

Last edited by gaucho (2014-03-26 19:39:54)


Imagination is more important than knowledge.

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#18 2014-03-30 17:43:58

leodevil
Contributor
Registered: 2014-03-30
Posts: 15

Re: group buy for proxmark3

Hi,

Im from Portugal..

I have interest for proxmark3...there is anyone who can sell it from Europe?

Thanks.

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#19 2014-04-23 10:11:03

gaucho
Contributor
From: France
Registered: 2010-06-15
Posts: 428
Website

Re: group buy for proxmark3

if you can wait 6 months yes big_smile


Imagination is more important than knowledge.

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#20 2014-04-27 22:05:01

MilkThief
Contributor
Registered: 2014-04-11
Posts: 104

Re: group buy for proxmark3

If you plan to produce the LCD version, keep me in mind! :-)

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#21 2014-04-28 21:30:25

betelgeuse
Contributor
Registered: 2013-12-24
Posts: 15

Re: group buy for proxmark3

I received the board from the group buy and i'm very happy with it. When it will be ready, i may even buy a second unit big_smile

Last edited by betelgeuse (2014-04-28 21:37:25)

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#22 2014-04-28 23:56:10

MilkThief
Contributor
Registered: 2014-04-11
Posts: 104

Re: group buy for proxmark3

Did you plan a second group buy for the standard PM3?
Gaucho, watching at your "CAP" in a old post, I suspect you live in a city where I go often...
I could offer you a beer with a supplì, if I'm not wrong... ;-)

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#23 2014-04-29 18:39:19

charliex
Contributor
From: Los Angeles/Scotland
Registered: 2010-08-05
Posts: 70
Website

Re: group buy for proxmark3

FYI We built like 15-18 of the pm3lcd's and only ever got the HF read to work semi reliably at best.

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#24 2014-04-29 19:25:19

MilkThief
Contributor
Registered: 2014-04-11
Posts: 104

Re: group buy for proxmark3

Ok, thank you for the info... I'm new of this forum (and "toy"), so I have to read old posts (it will take a while) in order to be updated and learn a lot of things you know well.
So the best current way to have a "mobile" pm3 is the proxdroid?
And a better way would be an android app?

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#25 2014-06-09 17:32:52

gaucho
Contributor
From: France
Registered: 2010-06-15
Posts: 428
Website

Re: group buy for proxmark3

thief u're not wrong.

about the boards: my next group buy will be for the low cost version of the board on 2 layers.
i do it for free, so give me a lot of time and i'll do it.


Imagination is more important than knowledge.

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#26 2014-06-09 18:17:45

eskizle
Contributor
Registered: 2011-07-18
Posts: 26

Re: group buy for proxmark3

Hi.

I am interested in one. Please add me for the another order.

I guess there is 7 units now (me included)

Regards.

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#27 2014-06-12 19:09:46

albertito12
Member
From: MADRID, SPAIN
Registered: 2013-08-05
Posts: 3

Re: group buy for proxmark3

Gaucho .... With all the problems you've solved with version 4 layer, why you're going to complicate the cavity with a version of two-layer printed circuit? (longer tracks, problems timming, speed of integrated capabilities and parasitic inductances, etc).

Alomejor intersada people would roll in a second group buy, a 4-layer printed circuit board, and it would be all out. (it's an opinion)

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#28 2014-06-13 18:14:58

leodevil
Contributor
Registered: 2014-03-30
Posts: 15

Re: group buy for proxmark3

gaucho wrote:

thief u're not wrong.

about the boards: my next group buy will be for the low cost version of the board on 2 layers.
i do it for free, so give me a lot of time and i'll do it.

I'm also interested in one unit...
This one could clone indala cards right??

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#29 2014-06-20 23:12:42

noko
Contributor
Registered: 2014-06-17
Posts: 14

Re: group buy for proxmark3

1 unit for me, please.

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#30 2014-06-21 01:57:21

gwenhastings
Member
Registered: 2014-06-21
Posts: 1

Re: group buy for proxmark3

add me in (1 unit)  please and it would be preferable to have the 4 layer if going 2 layer will introduce more problems , something to think about..

      gwen

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#31 2014-06-21 07:51:03

gaucho
Contributor
From: France
Registered: 2010-06-15
Posts: 428
Website

Re: group buy for proxmark3

albertito12 wrote:

Gaucho .... With all the problems you've solved with version 4 layer, why you're going to complicate the cavity with a version of two-layer printed circuit? (longer tracks, problems timming, speed of integrated capabilities and parasitic inductances, etc).

Alomejor intersada people would roll in a second group buy, a 4-layer printed circuit board, and it would be all out. (it's an opinion)

By removing unneded components and paths we will simplify the board and it will be easy to manufacture, the risks will be less and the cost will be lower.

The classic board is expensive. The  group buy resulted in a loss of time and money for me. I can't do it now for 90€.  No one can do it in a lucrative way.
I did it cause it also was a study and a kind of game.

The game can continue if i can add something new to this project.

The prototype is not expensive cause you can prototype 2 layers pcb for 20€
I have part of the components.
We just need to prepare the pcb.
If someone has the time to draw the pcb  i can share the updated schematic.
If we will find problems we lost about 100€ in total.

Last edited by gaucho (2014-06-21 07:51:27)


Imagination is more important than knowledge.

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#32 2014-06-23 17:42:11

charliex
Contributor
From: Los Angeles/Scotland
Registered: 2010-08-05
Posts: 70
Website

Re: group buy for proxmark3

I made a two layer board, but it was noiser so i went back to the 4 layer. It will be very difficult, if even possible, to do a 2 layer board with the same noise levels as the 4 layer, i split the board off into analogue/digital as much as i could as well. I added and changed a few components to try to make the whole board have better power signals altogether.

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#33 2014-06-24 16:29:44

gaucho
Contributor
From: France
Registered: 2010-06-15
Posts: 428
Website

Re: group buy for proxmark3

if you leave unchanged the schematic, how can you obtain the same noise level?
i think it will work WITHOUT problems, mainly by removing, unneded paths (mainly RAW inputs and CROSS inputs) , unneded facilities ( multiplexer and relay) and few other details, but i'm positive by nature.
now i'm in germany, i'm working a lot this period.
i will try to find the time, but if someone wants to prepare the pcb, i can share the BOM and the schematic.

p.s.: also removing the hirose connector and replacing it by a 2 pins header (2).
the switch from hf to lf is made by moving a jumper. if you're working on an exploit you change antenna, and to move a jumper is not a problem.

we will also add a jumper to let you supply the board from  a battery without the need to add power regulators. the market is full of chinese batteries supplied with recharger.

we will also replace the usb connector with the new one, so we can share the same standard cable used on our smartphones.

Last edited by gaucho (2014-06-24 16:38:49)


Imagination is more important than knowledge.

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#34 2014-06-25 03:20:09

charliex
Contributor
From: Los Angeles/Scotland
Registered: 2010-08-05
Posts: 70
Website

Re: group buy for proxmark3

By using a 4 layer board. It's really difficult to do a design like this with RF+digital+power+clocks etc and keep the noise levels down without splitting planes and large ground plane separation etc. Like i said i added more components to reduce the noise. As i said i've made a two layer board before, and the pm3lcd was also two layer but it didn't work that well, we built about 16 of those.

But the question is, how much noise is too much noise, where does it begin to affect the signal quality and results, will it hamper future code changes.

On my schematics, i have both usb's so you can choose which to use, i still have the the hirose, the OLED, sdcard and three buttons as well as a rechargeable battery. Hopefully i'll also have time to finish my stm32 version.

I brought the cost down by switching to a fpga i got cheaper , once i get the stm32 working its also a lot cheaper, but  i'm more interested in a proxmark that can be expanded to do more, as well as be usable without a PC, ours is working pretty good now.

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#35 2014-06-26 05:36:05

gaucho
Contributor
From: France
Registered: 2010-06-15
Posts: 428
Website

Re: group buy for proxmark3

your tries  were not centered on doing it cheaper, but on adding functionalities.
the noise level can be the same cause after these semplifications you can leave ground plane under RF part.

anyway i planned to add bluetooth functionality for easy integration with smartphones.
In order to do this i will not add components but i will just leave 4 pins header for extenal bluetooth module on second serial line.  If someone wants it, he can purchase apart the bluetooth module, and plug it.

The base concept is that if we do it cheaper we will have big comunity and the code will be developed fast.

otherwise we will not be able to follow the market and the protocols evolution.


Imagination is more important than knowledge.

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#36 2014-06-26 21:14:39

charliex
Contributor
From: Los Angeles/Scotland
Registered: 2010-08-05
Posts: 70
Website

Re: group buy for proxmark3

Actually i've built about 7 different proxmark PCB variants over the last three years, not just the conference badge. From just the RF section dev board style, pm3lcd, to the OLED/STM32 and new sam7 versions. 2 layer, and 4 layer boards.

It's not just the RF you need to worry about, its the ADC that needs it the most. But if you can route a 2 layer board with ground plane and separation with the RF and ADC's isolated and keep the noise down, you're a lot better at it than i am smile so i'll be curious to see what you come up with. I have routed two layer, but i ended up with some horrible long traces, the pm3lcd version has less stuff on it like you're saying ( in the RF section ) but that revision doesn't work well, so removing parts will make it easier to route, but still tricky.

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#37 2014-06-29 11:36:30

gaucho
Contributor
From: France
Registered: 2010-06-15
Posts: 428
Website

Re: group buy for proxmark3

ok maybe you're right, cause you seems to have big experience.
i'll try by myself, just to play with it.
have you ever tried to remove relay, multiplexer, cross inputs and raw inputs? the routing on 2 layers will be much more easy.

Last edited by gaucho (2014-06-29 11:39:13)


Imagination is more important than knowledge.

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#38 2014-06-30 22:41:55

charliex
Contributor
From: Los Angeles/Scotland
Registered: 2010-08-05
Posts: 70
Website

Re: group buy for proxmark3

yes, the pm3lcd has most of that removed.  It'll make it easier, but its still gonna be tough (keeping signal integrity)

Like i said, how much is too much, i have a fully routed two layer pm3 that uses the STM32 board, i just haven't finished the code for it to test it and see how the signal quality is, but it has some ugly traces..

I dunno if the 4 vs 2 layer is a worthwhile cost savings though, compared to the rest of the board. in orders of 10 PCBs, you're looking at $2 vs $8 USD, and you could probably find it cheaper than that.

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#39 2014-07-17 19:25:49

Caglio
Member
Registered: 2014-07-17
Posts: 1

Re: group buy for proxmark3

I am interested for one proxmark Shipped to Italy, please contact me for payment
Regards

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#40 2014-10-03 16:21:16

leodevil
Contributor
Registered: 2014-03-30
Posts: 15

Re: group buy for proxmark3

I'm interested in one unit!
Please contact me for payment.
Thanks.

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#41 2014-10-08 11:30:55

Griunvaldas
Member
Registered: 2014-10-08
Posts: 3

Re: group buy for proxmark3

I would buy one unit also, please count me in!

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#42 2014-10-23 22:51:48

lalelu
Member
Registered: 2014-10-23
Posts: 4

Re: group buy for proxmark3

Hi!!

Is there still a active group buy going on??

I'm interested in 1 piece with antennas, shipping to germany.

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#43 2014-12-21 02:18:28

babilou
Member
Registered: 2014-12-21
Posts: 1

Re: group buy for proxmark3

Hello,

One unit for me too please  smile
Just let me know for the payment.
Shipping location : France 

Regards

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#44 2015-01-12 23:20:36

ale88
Contributor
Registered: 2014-04-13
Posts: 10

Re: group buy for proxmark3

I'm also interested in one unit please...
Shipping to Argentina
Thanks

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#45 2015-04-13 12:45:27

perimbean
Member
Registered: 2015-04-13
Posts: 6

Re: group buy for proxmark3

Hi!

I'm interested in getting a unit of the Proxmark 3.

Please let me know if the group buy is still on.

Thanks!

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#46 2015-04-13 12:50:02

asper
Contributor
Registered: 2008-08-24
Posts: 1,409

Re: group buy for proxmark3

This group buy ended; if a new one will appear it will be in another thread.

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